Wolf count raises questions about Michigan range, threats
A captive gray wolf at the Wildlife Science Center in Minnesota.
By Megan Durisin
The agency confirmed two wolf observations last year in the northern Lower Peninsula. Greg Wright, a wolf specialist at Michigan Technological University, said they were probably lone dispersers who were unable to set up a territory.
“I don’t expect they will find a significant number of wolves in the Lower Peninsula in this year’s survey because there is not a breeding population there,” Wright said.
Dennis Fijalkowski, Michigan Wildlife Conservancy executive director, said wolves have been in the Lower Peninsula for 20 years and there have been credible sightings in Roscommon County. A pilot sighted a wolf pack crossing the ice from St. Ignace 12 years ago, he said.
“I have every suspicion they’re moving south,” Fijalkowski said.
Brian Roell, a state wildlife biologist in Marquette, said the gray wolf has gone back and forth on the endangered species list four times in the past 40 years.
“It’s hard for us as far as management, and it’s eroding the public support we once had for wolves,” Roell said.
Roell said the change of the wolf’s endangered status has mostly been due to efforts by the U.S. Humane Society to protect the animal. Roell said the wolf should be taken off the list because it’s met the federal requirements for delisting.
“We’re reaching the social carrying capacity,” Roell said, referring to how many wolves the public is willing to tolerate.
Gray wolves are a non-game species, and even if they were removed from the endangered species list, they could not be hunted legally, Roell said.
The U.S. Fish and Wildlife Service investigated 16 illegal wolf killings across Minnesota, Wisconsin and the UP in January.
Wright said there is no definite figure on how many wolves Michigan can sustain, but said he thinks the state can support current populations. The number of prey, amount of vacant land, disease and human tolerance are all factors.
“In many areas where wolves and humans live together, human-caused mortality is the main reason for wolves dying,” Wright said, citing Isle Royale National Park in Lake Superior, which has no permanent residents, as an exception.
Fijalkowski said he doesn’t think wolves moving into the Lower Peninsula will cause a threat because of the large amount of wild prey.
“In a state with 1.8 million deer, I can’t see it being much of a problem,” Fijalkowski said. “We have three to four times the density of deer in the Lower Peninsula than the Upper Peninsula.”
Roell said 577 wolves were counted last year in the UP, but he expects the number to grow by about 10 percent.
Roell said there have been incidents of wolves preying on farm animals and pets in the UP, but they are uncommon.
“We certainly do have livestock depredation and some domestic pet depredation,” Roell said. “About 5 to 6 percent of farmers are affected.”
Wright said wolves prefer wild prey, but there can be problems when pups learn to feed on domestic livestock or lone wolves get too old to bring down wild prey.
“Wolves aren’t killing dogs out of a vicious streak but because they’re genetically hard-wired to view other canines as competition,” Wright said. “Wolves often kill other wolves from neighboring packs for trespassing into their territory because they’re basically defending their ‘supermarket.’”
Roell said farmers protect their livestock from wolves with non-lethal methods like noisemaking devices and strobe lights. Husbandry practices also must be taken into account, he said.
“Things like making sure animals that go down are properly buried and maybe moving cows that are calving up to the barn,” Roell said. “Guard dogs are good, too.” Amy Spray, resource policy specialist for the Michigan United Conservation Clubs (MUCC), said the organization recommends taking the gray wolf off the endangered species list.
“In this case, the Endangered Species Act has worked,” Spray said. “The wolf population has come back and even overshot goals.”
Spray said MUCC would favor a hunting season on the wolf, which would require a change in legislation.
Fijalkowski of the Michigan Wildlife Conservancy also said while wolves in the Lower Peninsula need a place, the state needs to enforce management practices for wolves that don’t behave.
“If you don’t have a safety valve and the ability to take out animals that are killing livestock, there will be no respect for these beautiful animals,” Fijalkowski said.
However, Wright of Michigan Tech said the state must take precautions when managing wolves because they play an important role in keeping ecosystems healthy, and that public education is key in wolf management.
“All those fairy tales, fables and the like have created a wolf in the imagination that is very different from the real wolf living out its life just trying to find a mate, raise pups and kill enough prey to survive,” Wright said.
Great, informative! My only complaint is the comment about fairy tales and fables in the 2nd to last paragraph, I don’t know what that refers too?
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[...] Laura Fosmire LANSING, Mich. – Michigan’s gray wolf may be getting the most attention, but it isn’t the only species jumping on and off the [...]
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the claims of predation by wolves on dogs on livestock seem way overblown and again points out the riduculous claim that man always has to be the apex predator. Hunters only spend a few weeks in the woods but animal predators have to make a year round living there. I also have hunted and shot deer in Michigan.
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Regarding the story about wolves in MI. Once again the numbers game is being played by the MI DNRE. All thru the Fall of 2009 and into this Winter the DNRE has been publicizing the wolf population at 520 animals. In this article Brian Roell quotes the number as 577 with a 10% increase, which is quite a change from previous statistics. Back in 2003 the wolf population was numbered at 350 with a 14% recruitment rate, which calculates to nearly 800 animals now. Now that number may not be any more accurate than the DNRE’s number, but I believe that the wolf population is much closer to 800 than the publicized 520, now revised to 577.
As for the flippant declarations regarding loss of livestock and pets, livestock losses are compensated by the State or Federal gov’ts, pet losses are not. Livestock are not pets, they are an economic investment by the owner and as such there is little attachment. Pets, however, have a significant personal and emotional ties with their owner, even if they are just used as hunting aids. I have 3 Brittanies and I exercise them regularly in Michigan’s outdoors as well as hunt with them, and we have once had a wolf encounter. Fortunately the dogs got back to me in time, even tho the wolf followed them to 30 yards from me and remained within 50 yds. for a half hour. MI’s previous wolf expert informed me that likely only seconds remained before the wolf would have launched an attack on my dogs, had they not gotten back to me. I will not give up my right to enjoy the outdoors with my dogs year round, but I now take precautions such as belling my dogs everywhere we go, and carrying an equalizer when we are in certain areas.
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I can’t believe that you are so ignorant to let the public believe that wolves will not hurt the deer population. They said the same thing about the Yellowstone National Park Elk herd. The Elk population has dropped from 17000 elk to about 8000 Elk. The average age is 8 years old and no calves are surviving to become adult elk. This means in another three or 4 years there won’t be any Elk in Yellowstone Park. The wolf population is underestimated right now and the deer population is overestimated. The DNR has been doing that for years. I have seen two different wolves this past winter very close to a residential area. Eventually a person will be attacked in Michigan just like the young lady was in Alaska. Eventually the people paying taxes on deer camps with no deer will take a toll on the wolves.
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Leave my wolf alone
Hot debate. What do you think?
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The MI DNRE estimates 520 wolves in the Fall of 2009, then estimates 570 in the Winter of 09-10. Are they reproducing in Winter now? They quote a figure of 14% recruitment to the population, annually, just a few years ago, now they quote 10%. Based on the 14% figure I calculate closer to 800 wolves than 570. Ontario quotes a 20% recruitment figure. Who is right, or does it depend on mitigating public outrage? In any event the social carrying capacity has been exceeded by a lot, now it will fall to members of society to correct the numbers.
Hot debate. What do you think?
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I encountered an animal this am in burton michigan, this wolf looking animal came out of the ground as I was near its den. This animal was swift and knew just where to run to get away from me.
I will get video of it and put it here if I can
Thanks for reading this…
joe
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yes but some of the farmers killed live stock is from other animals to!!
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i think wolfs should be taken off the list
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i dont see a problem with wolves in lower mi. maybe it will lower the deer herd which would prevent a lot of car accidents. Have faith in Michigan’s wildlife biologists to keep track of the population and keep a good balance of what is healthy and safe.
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I agree with Patrick. I would love to see wolves in lower Michigan. I think they would help with the deer population. Not to mention that they are beautiful creatures that try to stay away from humans if possible.
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Wolves will reduce the deer population if they do distribute themselves in numbers. But not in a bad way. Wolves reduce the sick, old, and otherwise unhealthy/unfit prey animals in a given population. Lower Michigan is way over-populated with deer, who have few predators (besides man) in the L.P. The deer population would benefit from having a natural source of popultaion control. I see dead deer at least every mile on main roads in downstate Michigan. With a deer population density in some areas of over 30 per sq. mile, and wolves generally being in packs of less than 10 and inhabiting a territory of hundreds of square miles, I hardly think the deer population is in any danger if wolves should move back to Lower Michigan.
Hot debate. What do you think?
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i wonder why ppl have different thoughts!!..?????
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i say DEERs should be takein off the list not wolves!!!!!
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I say, trap and transfer all the wolves from the U.P. to the southern L.P.. Then let’s listen to all the howls, which won’t only be from wolves, as they begin to prey on “sick, old, and infirmed” livestock and backyard pets.
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To Virginia:
you know all those stupid stories like Little Red Riding Hood ,the three little pigs & stuff where wolves are killing & eating people and animals just for the hell of it. He was just saying thats not how wolves really are unless they are hurt and unable to hunt or have rabies or something.
I also agree with Patrick , Karen ,Jasmine & Trillium !!!!!!!!
Hot debate. What do you think?
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If you want to see quite a lot of wolves, come to Grand Traverse County! Wolf packs are seen here all the time. My daughter was driving through Hoosier Valley just south of Traverse City and saw a pack of four or five wolves that were quite large about five years ago. My mother lives in Grawn just outside of T.C. and also has seen wolves near her home. They’re pretty common here as well as are coyotes. The only animal we’ve heard is now also in our area but don’t know anyone yet who has personally seen one, is the cougar.
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it was stated in an earlier post that livestock killed by wolves that compensation was paid to the farmer check that out again ..inorder for compensation to be paid, enough of a carcass has to remain for an “expert” to test to prove that the animal was acctualty killed by wolves and not by dogs or anyother predator.
If the state of Michigan is anything like most other states all that a farmer will be compensated will be fair market value (meat price), breeding stock animals can run into the thousands of dollars you do not get that money back. It,s a tough situation what ever side of the fence you are on..
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We have lived in Lake Ann for 3 years. One night about 4 mo. ago I awoke during the night to loud howling. It didn’t sound like coyotes, no yipping at all, just the howl. Can’t remember if it souunded like more than one together. This moring, it was just starting to be light outside, and I heard the howling again. I really paid attention, and it was only one howl at a time. Listened to wolf howls on the internet this morning and I am convinced that it was wolves I heard.
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There will never be a problem with too FEW deer in MI. I’ve driven from central MI to Detroit and seen deer in EVERY single open field over the entire 150 mile trip. Additionally, deer will live in areas that wolves won’t venture in to. A couple months ago a deer crashed through the window on a Coney Island just down the street from me in Farmington Hills. If that ever starts happening with wolves, then maybe we’ll have a something to talk about…but until then…
Wolves were in MI long before humans were and they deserve to live here as much as we do.
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I’m already scared to go into my woods becuase of the damn cougars the DNR has released into MI to kill deer, The last thing I need to worry about is Wolves trying to kill my animals.
People just need to learn to leave things alone.
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The guys deer hunting on my property in Kalamazoo County today heard howling as it got dark, not the usual coyote yipping.
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I have no idea why there isn’t a wolf season yet! This is getting ridiculous! The Federal and Michigan Grey wolf managment plan made it very clear that they would stay in close contact with the citizen in which wolves live to make sure the cultural capacity isn’t over come! I’m a hunter and I don’t have a problem with a resonable number of wolves. They are now beyond that reasonable level, especially in the SW part of the UP, nearly all hunters I have talked to say it’s time to trim the population down. It’s true it will make the deer population stronger(if at a reasonable level), but it plainly states that the original goal was to achieve a population of 100 wolves in Michigan and Wisconsin for 5 years… Michigan alone now has nearly 600! Yes nature will eventually manage itself, but have any of these pro-wolf anti-hunting groups thought of how this will occur!?! The population of wolves will continue to grow until it reaches it’s carrying capacity…at this point they will begin to turn from wild prey to other forms of food. This includes anything living as the wolves get close to starving…including humans. Once the population runs out of food the UP’s deer population will be decimated, farmers outraged, and people’s lives endangerd maybe lost. These beloved wolves will then starve to death or die of disease. That’s how nature works. It’s not all little bunnies hopping around in fields of floweres…it’s cruel and unforgiving! This entire scenario could be completely averted by simply allowing a hunting season to maintain a safe and sustainable wolf population! UP residents and wolves both need a hunting season and SOON!
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[...] post: Wolf count raises questions about Michigan range, threats | Great … This entry was posted in Grand Traverse, Michigan | Up-North, resources and tagged Auto Green, [...]
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Agree with Jeremy. People need to remember, humans have invaded the animals home. If you get rid of animals, the eco-system will be out of balance. We (humans) should be the ones who try to live in harmony with animals…not push the animals to extinction.
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[...] Story: Wolf count raises questions about Michigan range, threats [...]
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[...] Story: Wolf count raises questions about Michigan range, threats [...]
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I say “stay away from da wolves”. They aren’t da ones to blame for the problems hunters and famers have. First of all hunters have been taking away their main food and all they think about is they won’t have enough game. It’s their fault that the wolves dropped in population in the first place. Then there goes da people wipping out their habitats. Now if farmers kept their animals secured and wouldn’t be making so many farms then they wouldn’t have a problem. SO I SAY KEEP UR MOUTHS SSHHUUTTT AND LAY OOOFFFF.
Hot debate. What do you think?
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I didn’t get to vote on having wolfs in michigan! there was a reson they were gone from Michigan, I don’t want them here as most people. do the 3 s’s shot them shovel and shut up! the dnre screw up things then they help any more! Everything they do should be voted on after all they work for the PEOPLE!
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I live in the U.p. where I see wolves 2 or 3 times a week. What I don’t see anymore is rabbits,squirrels,grouse,ratcoons, or any small animals. Last summer I was going out to the job site in the woods and seen a pack of wolves tearing apart a young fawn while what must have been the mother was watching from the other side of the road. Things were alot better when the wolves were not here.
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Many rabbit hunters from all over the State travel to the U.P. to utilised their highly trained Beagles. This has been another economic benefit for the U.P. that is soon to be gone. A recent trip to the U.P. end quickly as the dogs begin to run rabbits only to draw several Wolves. Within one hour of starting the hunt, two dogs were killed, three injuried, (one of these died a few hours later), hunt over.
People spend thousands of dollars on their dogs with training and care.
Unless you frequent the U.P. and have a interest that is lost, as with farmers, hunters, residents, you don’t understand the magnitude of this issue.
Result-lose in revenue to U.P. businesses.
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Larry– Sorry for your loss. I have Brittanies and several years ago while hiking with a friend and my dogs in a well used recreation area near Marquette we had an encounter with a lone wolf. Fortunately my dogs got back to me before the wolf attacked, but it followed them to 30 yds from us. Then for the next half hour it followed us at 30-50yds as we made our way back to the vehicle. So all the folks that say wolves stay away from humans don’t know what they are talking about. Armchair naturalists with no real understanding of the natural world. Now, when I am in areas that I even suspect could have wolves, I carry a 9mm equalizer. I will not be restricted in my outdoor activities by these cursed critters. Additionally, wolves or their tracks are frequently found on and along a x-c ski trail regularly used by skiers and their dogs near Marquette. But none of this is publicized by the natural resources agencies, it is not good PR. Also the MI DNR has been quoting a wolf population number of 570 animals for 3 yrs now, which means that the wolves must not be procreating. According to their 2003 population guess of 350 wolves and a recruitment (reproduction estimate) figure of 14% per year, there is more likely close to 800 wolves in MI now. Fortunately, hunters in the U.P. are starting to take care of the problem of too many wolves.
Of course, farmers are compensated for livestock killed by wolves, but pet owners are not, that is the fairness of our gov’t. Not that any amount of money can compensate for the killing of a family pet or highly trained sporting dog.
Interestingly enough, since the USFWS and MI DNR allowed the wolf population to get out of control, hunting license sales, especially deer hunting licenses are in decline. Mainly because it is tough to find deer in the U.P., now-a-days. All of the lost revenue from license sales and excise taxes on hunting goods is beginning to hamstring the MI DNR. What goes around, comes around.
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Carolin, seriously. dnt make so many farms? wht the hell famers are the men and women that work hard to make the food tht feeds your yapper and your family!!!!!
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Carolin, apparently you have no idea about hunting regulations. Hunters can’t shoot wolves in places with a low population of them. Also, it is not hunters’ fault that wolves are getting underpopulated in places, it is because the human population is getting bigger. We are spreading into their territory so they have less area to live.
And if all farmers kept their livestock inside small spaces there would only be factories that feed cows, chicken, pigs, etc. all corn. which would just lead to more diseases like e coli.
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I think for someone to coment on this, they should first be educated on it, or at least have an understaning about the food chain, and I’m not talking about the Wa-Mart “chain”. Yes, the MI deer heard is over-populated, and wolves may be an opportunity to keep them in check. This also means that it will sustain an overpopulated wolf population. Once the deer poulation is under control, the wolves are still overpopulated and then we still have problems from too many animals, only now the overpopulated species is a preditor, not a herbivore. So now the car deer accidents have changed into livestock, pet, and possibly human predation…. What problem do you want Carolin?? Some kind of management needs to be done. I agree, predation is ugly. It is death, but death to suport life, no matter how you look at it. We are another species on earth protecting our livelyhood just like the deer wnd the wolf. I suport a hunting season for wolves, weather I hunt them or not they need to be managed in some way.
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Southern MI will soon have an abundance of wolves because of the food supply there, such as deer, livestock, yard pets, and house pets out for a pee. The more food available, the faster they will reproduce. So, if you sit there smugly thinking it is just a problem for dem Yoopers, think again, the wolves are coming to your neighborhood, it’s just a matter of time.
Just Google wolf predation and you will find examples of how wolves attack and kill, and sometimes feed on their victims while still alive. It is not a pretty sight. By the way, wolves do not consume all of their kill before going on the hunt again, often times just eating the choicest parts. Also they do not target just the sick or aged, a pack can take down all but the largest, healthiest, fully antlered bull moose. Those are just wive’s tales spread by the wolf advocates. Wolves will wantonly kill any canine encountered, that is not in the protective presence of humans, and will stalk waiting for an opportunity.
Welcome to the real world of wolves, not the Disney version.
Hot debate. What do you think?
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Yesterday while traveling north on I-75 about a half mile south of Grange Hall Rd, I spotted a single wolf about 50 yards off the E-way in a small field. Quite impressive in size.
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I live on a farm in northern lower michigan where we raise cattle, horse, breed dogs, rabbits, and pigs – etc.. I have lived here for thirty plus years. I have seen wolves for the past eight years or more. In all this time I haven’t lost one animal to wolves. I love to hear them howling and seeing a glimpse of them occassionally. I don’t believe wolves are the evil monsters that some people believe they are. Deer, raccoon, rabbits, skunks, and oppossum do more damage to our crops and farm than anything. Crows, seagulls, starlings and blackbirds are grain/worm eating machines. These lesser animals that are less “feared” do more damage by far.
I believe that wolves should have a place here in michigan. They are a natural predator, they have grace and beauty. I do not believe that they are wonton killers. Do some research people, wolves eat millions of mice a year, an acre of ground can have up to 4,000 mice. I have neighbors that are lazy, drunk/druggy deadbeats, who don’t work – ever – that steal – lie – cheat and poach more deer and cause more harm than a pack a wolves! I’ll keep the wolves.
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i know thats its illegal to own wolves in michigan. but over the years i have known people that have and have no problems with them because they are responsible pet owners. after all every dog we own originated from the wolf. i thinks numbers in lower michigan are higher than they are telling us. im sure some people that have kept them as pets have had them get loose from their yard or runaway. im betting we do have a breeding population. wouldnt that be nice. i for one would love to see them. what i dont agree with is how the coyotes are dealt with and would hope the same wont happen to our wolves. god put all animals on this earth for a reason and the native americans had no problems living with them at all and have learned from them. i wish i could do more to help the wolf. but for now all i can do is pray. im a person that loves all gods creatures.
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lets not talk about all the cats people let run free outside that very soon will contribute to species of birds that will be extinct. maybe the farmers should get rid of all their cats so when the wolves do come to their own back yard they will have somethings else to eat besides their livestock.
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You can believe what you want to believe, but, the facts tell the story. On lands surrounding Yellowstone Park ranchers have significant wolf predation on their livestock. This is also occurring in the U.P. These ranchers are reimbursed for their livestock losses by the Federal gov’t with our tax money. However, wolves have reduced the elk herds near Yellowstone from 16,000 animals to 6000, as estimated by U.S. Fish and Wildlife. They have also taken a severe toll on mule deer, whitetail deer, wild sheep and goats, and moose as well. There is no compensation to hunters, hunting outfitters, guides, grocery stores, gas stations, motel owners, etc. for their losses.
So if you are anti-hunting, come right out and say it, don’t couch it in “oh the poor wolf, or how you love all God’s creatures”. Just make your stand and let people know where you are coming from. By the way, when a wolf visits your neighborhood and takes your dogs or cats or horse or worse, don’t start whining.
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i think paul needs to read lauris story.
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furthermore im not antihunting. my family has been hunting for years.
they also do not bait. what kind of sport is baiting a bid pile u know the deer or bear will come to and eat and then hunters shoot them. whats the sport in that? that takes no skill thats not hunting. so watch what u say paul.
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I think the packs in the U.P. should be killed
Hot debate. What do you think?
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last sumer in july my son and me where atv 10 miles above atlanta mich when we seen an animal doing a figure 8 then a cirle we couldn:t tell what it was at a distiance so we whent to investage it took down a atv trail and it was a long ways off going down a hill when I figure out what it was I satd Craig its a wolf it keep going out of site we stood buy our machine talking about what we saw then it decide to come back at us wide open it came with in 50 foot I put a bulett in frount of it and it did a reverse we fouled it for a while on our machines when it founc its parter they where close to 4 foot tall white with brown cirle on hips long tunges big ears I firmly belive it whanted me for diner I had a bleeding ulser and it thought I was eazy pre I lost all my blood 2 weeks latter but mange to live again Rich
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I am a long time Michigan resident and have spent most of my life in rural upper Michigan. I’m not anti-hunting in the least, but most of what people are saying here against wolves is ignorance. Deer, rabbits and other small animals are only so numerous because of the imbalance that WE created by killing most of their natural predators, not because they are “supposed” to be thick on the land for easy human picking. They are less obvious both because of a HEALTHY population reduction and because they have learned to become more wary of predators, making it harder for loud, blundering humans to stumble upon them. Bear and cougar are more dangerous to people than wolves are, but because of centuries of mythology people have a knee jerk reaction to wolves. Can wolves be dangerous? Of course, as can any large predator, or any wild animal in general. But even if a wolf did one day kill someone in Michigan, why does that mean that wolves as a species do not deserve to inhabit wild areas that can sustain them? Would you also kill off all the bears, mountain lions, coyotes? Well, maybe you would. But you should also then kill off all cattle, horses, domestic dogs, bees and donkeys, since they kill more people yearly than any wild animal species. Maybe you’re the kind of person who believes that only that which never presents any harm or inconvenience to man deserves to exist, but in the scheme of things, we’re the most dangerous thing around, to ourselves and all other life. Nature happens, but when it happens in a way that doesn’t work for us we moralize it rather than trying to understand it and take rational measures. Wolves aren’t evil. Wolves rarely show aggression towards humans. They will kill dogs and livestock, but it’s not out of maliciousness, it’s instinct. Does that pose pain for people? Yes, but there are was to manage that which do not require killing off all wolves.
The idea that deer will go extinct in Michigan because of wolves is absolutely insane – if that were true, no deer would have existed at all in North America by the time Europeans got here, since wolves were numerous throughout the whole continent. Obviously the people spouting that don’t have even a bit of logic in their heads or they’d see how ridiculous that claim is. I was in Yellowstone just last summer and saw plenty of elk everywhere. Also, predator populations rise and fall naturally with their prey. Any “extra” wolves WILL die off if the deer herd gets reduced. Don’t believe it? How do you think nature managed to exist without constant human direction for so long? People should leave things alone? Yeah, which would mean wolves would never have been wiped out to begin with. Was there are “reason” for this extinction? Sure, people make mistakes. Isn’t history full of them?
Predation is unsettling to watch, OF COURSE. Wolves don’t have some special corner on the market for that, do you think deer enjoy being killed by any predator, including man? If you don’t like wolves, fine, but don’t spout fake “facts” to make them into monsters. Wolves are just animals doing what they do, not angels or devils. I respect and value them for what they are, and wish more people would do the same. If all sides would approach this with a level head instead of a bunch of emotional reactions, they’d be more successful in getting their voices heard. You think a bunch of biologists are going to listen to you if all you can do is parrot “facts” that they know damn well aren’t facts at all?
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if wolves keep on getting deer then deer will start running out and the wolves will have to start using humans as there prey so wolves should be takin off the E.S. list so there population doesnt grow to big and get all the little scared kids.
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There should be a season on wolves once the population is high enough. We have a season on everything else, except the mountain lions that the DNR denies existing.
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I think some posters should climb down from their ivory towers and put their feet on the ground, in the woods, and face up to reality. Our society is no longer in the 19th Century and we cannot turn back the calender. Wolves have a place in our world, as a symbol of what was, a symbol to be viewed and appreciated, but, not as a competitor for Man’s vocations and pursuits. Like it or not, we have replaced wolves as the “top dog”, and there ain’t no going back. Deals were made regarding what constitutes a scientifically viable wolf population and they have far exceeded those benchmarks. If gov’ts ignore that, then the folks will bring wolf numbers down to a socially acceptable level, just as they did a lifetime ago.
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On the other hand, some posters should try to elevate their understanding of the natural world, and try to appreciate the marvelous creatures on this earth which have every right to live. Just because Man is literally destroying the world does not mean that, in some small measure, we should not try to restore the natural balance whenever possible. But our efforts should not just be for wildlife; for, truly, our existence is enriched when we can revel in the wonders of nature. (But, I understand that some just want the exclusive right to shoot and kill those species which might be prey.)
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where i do understand that wolves are endangered animals and people are scared that they may attack. i feel they don’t mean anyone any harm. they are living families just like us and want to protect their families from us just like we do to protect our families from them. they do mean us any harm and should be feared like many people do. i commend the organizations that help restore the wolf population to its former glory.
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2011. I came upon a wolf in a semi-heavily wooded and secluded area in Lawton, MI in April of this year while mushroom hunting. I also saw one in Cass County, near Marcellus, MI, in a densely wooded area last year. My brother mentioned to me “they howl” not yip. They were way too large in size to be a coyote, as I had originally thought, and while perusing pictures on the internet…yup…I am convinced I saw a wolf.
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For those of you who are against the wolves and are posting your comments on here, please consult biologists on your views on wolves. The wolf expert biologists do not share your views on wolves. How do I know? I am a Wildlife Biologist who specializes on Mammal Terrestrial Carnivores.
Joe: When you have a keystone predator that increases in population, then the prey population begins to decrease. Once that prey population decreases, then the predator population begins to decrease because there is a lack of food main food source. By having less food, competition increases and fatality occurs. Also, if there is not enough food, then the females do not have enough protein to develop the zygote. These are two major factors for the predator population decrease if the prey population has fallen.
Paul: Wrong! The predation factor on livestock by predators in the NRM region is only 1%, and only a fraction of that (0.01%) is done by wolves. This is according to the USFW. The 16,000 elk in Yellowstone was above carrying capacity. The presence of wolves and their keystone status managed that population to around 6,000-7,000 and has been stable for the past 5 years. Now you are seeing a decline in the wolf population because there is less elk in the park. This goes back to my point about predator populations decreasing when the prey population decreases. And, why do you think there is such an abundant amount of deer in the lower part of Michigan? Because the population in the upper part continues to climb meaning there is not enough wolves to manage it.
Andy: People like you have been using that argument that wolves will hurt the deer population since the late 1960s according to Dr. David Mech and Rolf Peterson. So, since people like you have been saying that wolves in the Great Lakes have been hurting the deer population since the late 1960s, how come the deer population in Michigan, Wisconsin and Minnesota is at its highest points ever? Michigan is currently at 1.8 million which is higher then it was back in 2000 (1.2 million).
Carl: No one had a vote on wolves. They were not reintroduced, they migrated back to their former natural ranges. I don’t get where you think wolves were reintroduced. The mentality from your ancestors to wipe out wolves was through hysteria and not factual information. We as a country did not know much about wolves in the early 20th century, and is the major reason why this country eliminated them, as well as to protect the new form of farming that was developing in the west at the time. The wolves were not killed because of the damage they did to livestocks then, they were killed because of the THREAT they posed to livestock, and that mentality is shared by individuals in the modern day and age, and you are proof of it. After not having any or little presence of wolf population for nearly 80 years, we saw a drawback on many species whether it is increasing heavily in populations, or decreasing heavily in populations. Elk boomed in population, coyotes (as much as I love them) boomed in populations, beavers in Yellowstone decreased to 1 colony, fox population in Yellowstone shrunk, eagle population decreased, etc. The studies researched and concluded that a lack of keystone predators (cougars, wolves, grizzly bears, etc) were a major reason for this. Now that wolves have a population you are seeing the populations with a high mark decrease to a stable level, and populations that had a low mark increase to a steady level. This is what is meant by keystone, the name alters all species in a ecosystem and manages the ecosystem to a normal level.
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We use the outdoors far differently than we did 50 years ago. Today there are groomed trails for hiking and cross country skiing. Trails are also available for horse riding, snowmobiling and four wheelers.
As wolves pack-up they will become more emboldened. It is naive to think one can predict what a wild animal that is carniverous is going to do. I for one, fear any animal that has the power to take down a bear. Humans are also carniverous, how many times have we had seconds at the dinner table or desert on a full stomach. Just because a wolf has just taken down a deer doesnt mean a lonely cross skier isnt going to look good. Might equate it to a nice fresh carrot cake waiting to be cut into.
Its a matter of time before we have human casualites. Paul’s story about his encounter with a wolf and his dogs is nothing short of chilling. Wolves are extremely smart, powerful and lethal.
As far the the DNR and the U.S. Forest Service goes, the havoc and mismanagment I have seen those mongolian idiots do to the Hiawatha National Forest in the Upper Peninsula – I would like to see a few of their decision makers go “dance with the wolves”. Lets see how that work’s out for them.
Remember folks, its the DNR and the U.S. Forest Service that has opened up the woodlands to pedistrian recreation. They than promote the population growth of a lethal preditor into the mix. Than they tell us there is nothing to worry about and they have it under control. I think that’s what the captain on the Titanic said to the passengers just before the stern disappeared under the North Atlantic. You can’t make this stuff up.
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i think its great to have the wolfs back i wanna see more numbers if it a problem for live stock then put fences up or what ever it take i feel like we as human invaded them why do we have to take their lives away from them. we as humans should be taking the proper step to prtect are live stop i really hope the number of wolves continue to GROW!!!
Hot debate. What do you think?
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To the Biologist, I too am a Biologist with 6 yrs. of academic studies and 30 yrs.of work in the field with a gov’t agency. I fully understand predator-prey relationships which work in a perfect world WITHOUT human presence. However, by reading my previous post you would have noted I said the elk population NEAR Yellowstone was decimated by wolves. Wolves and elk, deer, sheep and moose do not recognize park boundaries. Now, whether you hunt or not, or approve of hunting, that severe level of predation on big game animals negatively affected the pursuits and livelihoods of a large group of people. Let’s face it, humans are here to stay and we will continue to use wildlife populations for our benefit in a managed and regulated manner. We do not need large populations of predators to do the managing for us. These predators deserve a place in the landscape, but, we are now the keystone species. That is reality.
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Here are a couple of sites and articles I found interesting about the subject of wolf populations and their affect on wildlife. The first article is a little old but focuses mostly on historical accounts of wolf interactions.
http://www.aws.vcn.com/wolf_myth_legend_misconception.html
http://www.norcalblogs.com/gate/2010/08/video-of-the-largest-wolf-pack-ever-found-in-oregon.php
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I’m a wolf advocate and a hunter. That said, wolves need to be managed at levels that are socially acceptable and don’t negatively impact the hunting industry. Deer hunting is a multi-billion-dollar economic driver each year in Michigan and Wisconsin. These are extremely challenging times for our economy. A robust game population attracts paying hunters. A wolf-depleted population will drive hunters away, along with the license dollars and excise taxes on their equipment that pay for wildlife conservation of both hunted and non-hunted species.
Wolves are the leading cause of death on young elk in northern WI (that WI got from Michigan about 16 years ago). They can’t even get the elk herd off the ground after all those years. Imagine what’ll happen to Michigan’s elk should packs of wolves eventually locate in the northern Lower Peninsula. Yes, wolves will take the “weak” links, but if that means fawns, recruitment is lost. And after the weak are gone, they’ll tackle “healthy” but stressed animals, such as in winter yards, further depleting the resource. When deer numbers are low, guess what? They’ll supplement their diet with other wild critters, yes, but also are opportunists that will prey on livestock and pets. Wisconsin has seen a huge increase in not only killings of hunting dogs, but backyard pets.
If the feds don’t delist them soon and if states don’t get aggressive enough in reducing the numbers to goals set years ago, armed citizens will do it for them. They’ll never get ‘em all. That’s not the goal. But they do need to get the most bold and aggressive wolves, and reduce the overall numbers.
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I like the idea of having wolves here,…….in reasonable numbers.
200 was the number given for a viable ISOLATED population. Which Mi’s isn’t. But even so, I’d suggest we can, with ease, tolerate double that and perhaps even a few more…..long term.
As I write this (Nov. 14/11) the USFW 2012/11 population report now says we have 687 wolves. Fine for now, but long term may be not.
Further there is now, per MDNRE, one breeding pack in the lower penn. as well.
The truth the human pop. in the lower is not going to tolerate the kind of numbers the UP already has. Far more farms and people in the lower. Yet I am sure the anti hunt/animal rights groups will run for the courts the instant a hunt to control and limit wolf numbers is proposed, regardless of wolf numbers at the time. Such groups care far more for the wolf than the do for people, they’ve shown this repeatedly over the years. And this is why the Mi DNRE is focused far more on managing people than they are the wolves…….they know such lawsuits are VERY expensive. And Mi budget is tight already.
As others have stated throughout the list of post above mine, if the state fails to control wolf numbers, and very soon, the folks on site will. And it won’t matter if a few are prosecuted, most won’t be caught, and they’ll kill more wolves than a control action would. And such killing will not be even, it will be concentrated in some areas and thin in others. We’ll end up with few/no wolves in some areas and continuing high numbers in others. This is not good for anyone, wolves included.
It’s time for the Mi DNRE to strap on a set, and give thought to a hunt to limit wolves to a sane number in the UP. Perhaps 600 would be a figure that the people of the UP would accept.
While there is no need for a hunt in the LP, that day to will come. The DNRE needs to start considering at what number of wolves in the LP that will happen at. I’s strongly uge that the LP number should be no higher than 300.
That would be at total of 900 wolves in this state, which is far, far more than the anti hunt/animal rights groups could have hoped for just 15 years ago.
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I had a typo in the above post,
The USFW report was from 2010/11 NOT 2012/11.
Sorry
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Here is the site that I found the above number of 687 given by USFW for any wishing to check my numbers.
http://www.fws.gov/midwest/wolf/aboutwolves/mi_wi_nos.htm
I like the idea of wolves in Mi. But like Scoop above my first post, I believe we must keep the numbers controlled at a number that is good for both the wolves and people.
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18 wolves in one pack. no deer hunters coming to help by spendin some money.. not one hunter in the motel this year. other motel shut down..dont go in the woods without a gun.. this is no joke…to many wolves… help us please…let us drop a few of them so they dont act so aggresive twards man kind…city slickers when you come face to face with an animal thet big and it has no fear of you… see how you feel about em…yooperbilly
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Billy, where are you at? Never heard of a pack of 18 before, not saying it’s not possible though.
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You can report wolf sightings in Michigan at http://www.michiganwolfsightings.info
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Victor,
Thanks for the heads up on this. Who runs this site?
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Very interesting discussion. Obviously strong feelings on both ‘sides’.
I am a longtime ourdoorsman and hunter living in NE Ottawa County…between Grd Rpds and Musk. This morning I saw what looked to me like a wolf in the field by my house. I scrambled to get the binnoculars and got a good if brief look at the animal standing in full view on the frozen pond about 100 yds away. It was there for over a minute but walked into the brush before I could get a pic. It was large, not a German Shepherd or a coyote with a more pointed muzzle and slightly upturned nose. I was amazed at the possibility of it being a wolf and that’s what drove me to this sight…to ck on any other wolf sightings in lower mi. From what I’ve read here, I guess it may have been one! Jan 7, 2012
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David,
I run the website. The website is not DNR or other government related.
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We live in Grand Blanc off of Irish & Jordan Rds. We have a lot of deer around here. I have seen coyotes & heard them it is common knowledge they are around. But my son about 4 days ago was coming home on Jordan crossing Irish when he said he saw what he thought was a large wolf crossing the road. I said maybe it was a dog & he said he did not think so by the way it moved & it disappeared into a field with woods. My sister saw a cougar & she lives up near Columbiaville. The DNR told her she probably saw a deer or a large dog. She insisted it was a very large cat. A few evenings before she saw the animal she was out on her back deck & heard the growling which she said startled her & she went back inside then it was a few days later at dusk that she saw the big cat. A little internet search & I found a local article about a cougar sighting 6 months prior only about 1 1/2 miles from my sister. We have had reported sightings of cougars near Genesys Hospital. The one post on here is a reported sighting of a wolf off I-75 & Grange Hall Rd. That is very close to here. I do not trust the DNR to be honest in regards to sightings of protected species as they are afraid it will bring attention to the animals & potential poachers & also create some fear in residents.
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Sure would be the nice if our friends of the wolf would transplant about 5 of these wonderful preditors; that is, one male and 4 females into your city parks , then come back in 3 yrs, let the public know how you feel about them. Got too many tree huggers, environmentalists and Professed animal lovers who have no knowledge of animal needs. I would rather look a deer in the eye, than a snarling wolf. Yes, I live in the Upper Peninsula which is north of the Lower Peninsula (i.e., above the bridge)
.
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I visit the UP a lot and I live in the LP (Lower Peninsula) and there are
(according to the local farmers) way to many wolves. I personally on one day alone saw 12 wolves within a 20 mile radius of each other there are way too many wolves.
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My opinion on wolves is let the breed let them grow we need them here as much ad we need all our Michigan species. For the ppl who say wolves don’t belong here they were here before us and I hope will stay here for ever they had to reintroduce them due to Hunting to almost extinction due too ppls fears of them I love and truly adore the wolves they are such a beautiful animals who I hope one day will triple in population and then us hunters could find another animale to hunt in this great state . Remember people we moved into there house not the other way around
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